Tuesday, 23 December 2008

  • Educational Options: What do YOU think?

    Come January, I will very likely have 2 children in public school, 1 child in Christian private school and 4 who are homeschooling.  I am in a bit of a quandry as to how I want to proceed for the 2009-2010 school year.  Our experiences with all 3 options have at times been positive and at times negative.  Please answer the following questions with insights concerning pros and cons of each option.  Try to be open minded and not just "push" YOUR way or opinion. 

    What do you see as the pros and cons of:

    Public School?

    Private School?

    Homeschool?

    I hope to get some really valuable input on this topic.

    Thanks!

Comments (55)

  • Kristenmomof3

    Public School? depending on the school district they can get a very good education. may hear somethings you may not want them to hear. May win others to Christ. (S invited her teacher to harvest 08 and the teacher came and became a christian)

    Private School? expensive. Some of them can be worse then public schools in things that children can hear. Some of them your child can be treated as an outcast if they are not exactly like all the other children there.

    Homeschool? well, here in Pa all the rules and regulations. IT is inviting the government into your home more then sending them to public school is. and more is required then public school

  • hbasedmomof6

    @Kristenmomof3 - Thank you Kristen!  Can you tell me what you do at home to help your children have a strong Biblical mindset and worldview so that they can withstand the negative influences they come into contact with when they are away from you. 

    The private school my kids go to is a true ministry... all we  have to pay for are the books for $40 a month per child.  In a normal situation, I totally agree with all of your observations on that. 

    I had never thought about what you said on homeschooling.  Very interesting perspective though since I have been questioned by child services twice about my homeschooling though (due to anonymous callers).  One time, I had to pay $1700 retainer to have an attorney come with us to the interview and the case worker wound up being very impressed with my kids, especially my teens who have never drank/partied.  One time, a case worker just took a cursory glance at my bookshelves and all of our school work sitting around and did not even insist on seeing lesson plans, portfolio or anything.  :)

  • kriegerwulff

    Public School?

    There aren't any pros to public school, and I don't say this as the homeschooler who never went to a government institution. All class work progresses at the pace of the dumbest child, or which ever child is acting out the most. Teacher can't teach when they're constantly having to call down rambunctious children. The curriculum has progressively gotten worse over the years...and the material that is there, the children are only taught to the test. Pass the test, and you're good, actually learning the information isn't necessary. The only possible way to fail government school is to either (1) just not show up at all to any classes, (2) have an IQ below 60...otherwise, everybody passes. The piece of paper isn't worth anything, and it doesn't represent a body of knowledge aquired. Government school is a waste of time, and is only indocrination.

    Private School?

    Private school (and christian school) is where all the kids that the public schools didn't want to deal with are sent. Most of my peers went to either a private or Christian highschool, and there isn't any difference...and if possible, the moral character is worse than at government schools. This isn't just random bias or prejudice that doesn't have any basis in reality: anybody who thinks that private or christian schools are somehow "better" never talked to any of the kids from there; never sat in on a regular day.

    Homeschool?

    Homeschooling, while undoubtedly the best option of the three, isn't an easy pass either. FAR too many parents exist under the delusion that by simply saying "oh, we're homeschooling" that their children will (1) become very smart, (2) aquire the information, (3) out perform their peers...and yet they don't do anything with their children's education. They don't require a committment to educational excellence, they don't pursue academic knowledge, but simply sit around talking about how much smarter or how much further ahead **their children** are. Homeschoolers are rapidly spending the capital that the people in the 80s and 90s built up...the capital that homeschooling can give a better education than the government, at a much faster pace; that HS produces brilliant, academics. Go to an average homeschool group, and see if this holds true. I taught a homeschool coop class, I know whereof I speak.

    In conclusion, homeschooling is the only way, but it requires effort, committment and dedication. Children are not going to lay the intellectual foundation by simply uttering the magic words "homeschooling."

  • InAweOfCreation

    Public - I cringe at what these schools are becoming.  If a child is a Christian many of these schools can be almost a battle ground.  The facts show that 75% of kids who call themselves Christian lose their faith after attending college.  But a lot of that indoctrination begins in the public schools.   When schools teach evolution as a fact that leaves no room for God and so they start doubting the existence of God in the lower grades.  If I had young kids now I would find a way to homeschool or find a good private school.

    Private - Just because a school is labeled private does not necessarily mean it is better.  I would definitely look over their curriculum and see what they teach.


    Homeschool - This takes an incredible investment of time and energy but I feel that in today's world it is the very best way to educate a child.
  • javamommy

    hmmm i dont know if i can say anything positive about public school.I just really see it as the teachers getting them ready for standardized testing time and thats all they worry about now.I know this because i talk to my neighbor whos a teacher here and she hates how it has to be done.and the rotten attitude of others.I know not everyone has bad attitudes.The public school my kids went to for a bit 2 years ago was great onyl because i had very open communicatio with all the teachers but even then the kids still begged to come back home.

    Private school i agree with Kristen when she said that if the kid does not share the same beliefs they'll get picked on.I went to catholic school for middle school but was not catholic.it was hard.but i loved the smaller class sizes.that was abig positive in my book

    homeschooling i think the downfall on that is having to listen to the nagativity from people who just dont get it.and dont take the time to understand how great homeschooling can be.the upside how great it can be.You get to spend time wth your kids go at their pace and inroduce them to things they might never have been inroduced to in the other 2 settings

  • Kristenmomof3

    @hbasedmomof6 - with my children we pray together. We do bible studies together. We listen to christian radio (we like HopeFm, which can even be listened to online) and stuff like that.
    Plus we have a really good public school system where many of the teachers are Christian.

    To be totally honest even if I would meet the requirements to homeschool in Pennsylvania (which I don't, so I can't legally homeschool) I would be scared to. I have heard to many horror stories from homeschooling families in the state of Pennsylvania.

    My children's experiences in Public school so far have been only good ones. Now I do understand that if when they get older if they wanted to get in with the wrong crowd they could (But they could do that even if they didn't go to public school if they really wanted to), but there are really good crowds in the public school too. There are bible study groups and all sorts of stuff like that at the public high school for after school clubs. Also there is release time in elementary school for grades 3 and up where they go to the near by church (If you want them to) and have bible study twice a month.

    I am alway open to talk about all schooling options when people want to talk. And I am really open to discussion all the options. The only time I am not is when someone tries to say what they are doing is the only right way and accuse me of being a horrible mom for sending my children to public school. Then I tend to get mad and close down on the whole subject. But I love discussing in when all sides can talk nicely to one another.

    Hope you are having a wonderful Tuesday.

    God bless.

  • Kristenmomof3

    For those of you who thing Public school is horrible. What would you suggest for those parents who can not afford a private school (which really can be worse then public school at times) and can not legally homeschool because of thier states rules?
    @kriegerwulff - @Hecalmsthestorm - @javamommy - 

  • hbasedmomof6

    @Hecalmsthestorm - I have heard these stats on kids losing their faith before.  Can you tell me where to find the documentation regarding studies done to this effect?  Thanks!

  • hbasedmomof6

    @Kristenmomof3 - Can you tell us more about the homeschool laws in PA which prohibit some people from homeschooling?  I am truly open to discussion on this topic right now.  I have had fairly positive experiences with public school myself.  Our school here has mostly Christian teachers who seem truly loving and kind with my kids, they do not "teach to the test" like the school they attended last year in TX when they were staying with their bio mom, they are very strict about bullying, the kids are very challenged academically and we have enjoyed getting to know some people in our community we would have otherwise not got to know.

  • radicalramblings

    I went to public school.  I hated it.  They teach that God is a fairy-tale and only ignorant people believe in fairy tales, while pushing parents to put their children on drugs for "add" because they don't want to actually deal with discipline in school anymore.  I was bored out of my mind because the class has to be dumbed-down to the lowest level of any child in the class and to heck with the smart kids.  If you're still on the first unit at the end of the semester, so be it, as long as little Johnny hasn't mastered it no one can move on.  I was punished by teachers for being in the GT program, because they resented having a kid pulled out of their classroom for a few hours a week to actually learn something.  I was teased by my peers for being in the "geek program."  In the older grades when that wasn't available I turned to drugs out of pure boredom (not peer pressure as some would think), and still proceeded to make straight A's.  They teach to a test that requires minimum basic standards that a ninth-grader SHOULD be able to pass - in TWELFTH GRADE.  I could go on and on but I won't do it here.

    I had homeschooled and private-schooled friends who did things in junior high, that we never did in public school.  Advanced reading curriculum, grammar, math, science, etc.  Stuff that I got to college and realized I should know but we never learned in public school.  And I was in the top 10% of my class so it's not like I just didn't pay attention that day.

    Pros & Cons, I dunno.  I  think that's something you have to decide for your own family.  But that's my experience.  Take it or leave it.  I'll never send any child of mine to that government-brainwashing minefield.

  • hbasedmomof6

    @Kristenmomof3 - Yes, I am truly open and want to keep this discussion respectful of all sides.  I truly believe that I have operated in fear in some regards in past years regarding this topic.  I taught in public school and private school before having children and with my 3 bio children... 1 of them has done public, private and homeschool and 2 of them have done mostly homeschool but some private.

  • hbasedmomof6

    @radicalramblings - Do you think it gets worse with junior high and high school?  I changed schools 25 times and have taught in all 3.  I have definitely seen some of what you mention here as a student and as a teacher.  But, I have also seen there are truly some decent schools/teachers still left out there as well.

  • javamommy

    @Kristenmomof3 - well homeschooling is not illegal in any of the 50 states.its just a little harder in some states.if you absolutly cannot see yourself being a homeschool mom then i suggest for the public school world to be constantly involved with your childs school not afraid to ask questions be around in the classrooms when you can to help out.Teachers need all the help they can these days with the bigger classes and such.being very involved with your kids homework and such.

  • LaurieAnnP

    No, Dear Friend, you do NOT want to know what I think!!!

    Best of luck to you!

    Love, prayers and fond wishes,

  • hbasedmomof6

    @LaurieAnnP - LOL... I could almost word it "for" you sister.  I am sure there have been times I felt the same way you do now and will probably always feel about this topic.  However, I really want to make sure I am not operating in fear when it comes to this topic.  I truly want an open forum where my readers have an open mind about other points of view.  We are all shaped somewhat by our experiences, but we should also be open to the fact that our experiences are not the "only" way. 

    I meant to say that I realize you will always feel the way you do and I thought I would always feel that way too... but I am open to exploring whether or not it is truly a Godly conviction or whether it is due to my own limited experiences and fear.  This crazy thing would not let me edit the comment even w/in the 15 min. timeframe. 

  • radicalramblings

    @hbasedmomof6 - I'm sure there are some decent teachers and schools left out there.  Unfortunately, the schools are few and far between and the teachers all too often find their hands tied by the school administration or even the state.  If you have found something that is working for your family then by all means stick with it.  But in my experience it is much more likely to find a really crappy school than a really good one.  I don't know if it's worse in junior & senior high.  I think it's all horrific, just in different ways.  Let's see, at my high school we once had to face down a SWAT team in order to have our "see you at the pole" meeting OUTSIDE OF SCHOOL HOURS at the school flag pole - while across campus, the Gay/Lesbian/Bisexual Alliance had their normal weekly meeting in a classroom at lunch time.   Need I say more?

  • Kristenmomof3

    @hbasedmomof6 - sure :)

    well, one thing is in Pa you must have a high school diploma to homeschool your children. (I only went to school through 10th grade)

    The supervisor of the home education program must certify on the affidavit that the supervisor and all adults living in the home and persons having legal custody of the child have not been convicted of criminal offenses. So anyone ever of anything criminal may not homeschool. And you can not homeschool if you would have an older child or relative or anyone living in the house that was convicted of anything criminal. (this doesn't apply to us but it could apply to someone who was convicted of something before they because a christian and turned their life around. THey can not homeschool)

    The supervisor of a home education student who has been identified as needing special education services pursuant to the Individuals with Disabilities Education Act (IDEA), must have a certified special education teacher or licensed clinical or certified school psychologist's approval of the home education program. (this applies to us too as W is considered "special")

    Also just a note...in Pennsylvania, School districts do not issue diplomas to students in home education programs.

    @javamommy - read above to see why we can't :)

  • mourning2dancing

    We've only ever had our son in public school, so that is the majority of my experience as a parent.  Although, as a pastor (especially when I was a youth pastor) I have walked through the experience of both private school and homeschooling with a number of families. 

    I can't begin to weigh in on all the pros and cons of each.  I do feel that in each kid's life as a student, environment is key.  In another state, my wife and I were very unhappy with the public education system as the teachers were overtly concerned with their class score on a specific standardized test, and not with the unique education of the student.  Whether my son learned anything or not was secondary to how he affected the average of the standardized test score for his class.  We very much wanted to pull him out, but could not financially pull off either private or home school.

    In the public school he's been in for a year, things are much different.  So different in fact, it's like the apples to oranges comparison - this public school and the previous one are not alike at all.  There is a genuine care for the kids expressed by the teachers & faculty, and my wife and I couldn't be happier with the education our son is getting.

  • kriegerwulff

    @Kristenmomof3 - I've several friends in PA who are currently homeschooling their children. I understand it is difficult there...PA is like in the top 3 worst states to homeschool in.

    My personal thoughts on the matter? Either ignore what the state says (Acts V:29), as they've no right to dictate educational activities of parents, and the charge of education is Biblically given to parents, and not the state. (Deut VI:6-7) Or, move to a state where the legal system is more friendly to parents fulfilling the role God gave them. (as did the Pilgrims) That the state prohibits a God given responsibility from being carried out, doesn't matter in the least to me.

    Nobody would ever say "oh, the state says I can't preach the gospel, so I guess I just can't"...

  • InAweOfCreation

    @hbasedmomof6 - I will have to find them again.  I will let you know.

  • LeahRC

    I have taught in public school and a Christian school and am now homeschooling.  This is our 5th year homeschooling.  So, that is where I am coming from.

    Public schools, IMO, teach very little.  It is impossible to have a classroom of 20 kids- all varying abilities and home situations and economic situations- and actually manage to "teach" much of anything.  As, a teacher, I felt like most of what I did was crowd control.  There were students who learned.  But, for the most part, these were bright kids whose parents were involved, and that is exactly WHY they learned.  There are also safety concerns in public schools- especially high schools.  I taught in a high school, and my classroom was across from the lunch room.  I kept my door locked every day at lunch because of the fights that would break out.  I had a very large, strong 9th grade boy who ate lunch with me every day because he was afraid of the lunch room!  And we live in a relatively small "safe" town, not a big city.  This was also a "good" public school.  There were many Christians in leadership- even several of the principals; teachers were loving and caring for the most part; there was a positive "family" environment throughout the staff.

    The Christian school I taught in had lots of positives- strong Christian curriculum, Christian teachers who loved and cared for students.  But, even then, you had the issue of being able to deal with students individually within a large class.  And the cost was most definitely prohibitive for many families with one income.  I saw women go to work and put their younger children in daycare just to send their older ones to the Christian school.  And I'm just not comfortable with that.

    Homeschooling has been wonderful for us, and I am thankful every day that God allows us to do this.  It is not easy.  It is not cheap- in money or in time.  But the benefits are too numerous to count.  I know what my children are doing every day.  I know what they are learning.  Academics are secondary to the life lessons we can learn every day by being together. 

    I heard it best said by a long time homeschooler before I even had children.  She said, "Parents are ultimately responsible for their children's education- whether you believe God is leading to homeschool or use a Christian or public school."  I hesitate to say that any of these options are "wrong" because I believe you have to do what God is calling you to do as a family.  I do, obviously, have strong opinions, and I believe we are doing the right thing for our family. 

  • hbasedmomof6

    @Hecalmsthestorm - Thank you because I have heard this a lot but have yet to see the actual study.  I sincerely want to take an honest look at this topic!  

  • Kristenmomof3

    @kriegerwulff - you say "My personal thoughts on the matter? Either ignore what the state says (Acts V:29), as they've no right to dictate educational activities of parents, and the charge of education is Biblically given to parents, and not the state."

    SO in other words you want the person to have their children taken from them by the state?

  • InAweOfCreation

    @Kristenmomof3 - The vast majority of people are in the same situation.  I was simply expressing my opinion.  If it were me and I sent my kids to public schools I would just stay very involved in what they are being told and taught.  I would try to work with my kids to balance some of the stuff they are indoctrinating with. 


    There is no way I was saying anything bad about your kids going to public schools.  If I inferred that, I apologize.

  • Kristenmomof3

    @Hecalmsthestorm - not at all :) I was just wondering what you would say to those parents. That's why I asked. I wasn't at all offended by your response.

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